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 KC looking for QB?

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PostSubject: KC looking for QB?   Fri Aug 31, 2012 5:15 pm

First topic message reminder :

Hearing Chiefs could trade for Matt Moore from Miami. Or sign recently released Brian Hoyer from NE.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sat Sep 01, 2012 11:52 pm

Chiefs09 wrote:
And I'm not saying it is a bad roster. this team is loaded with talent. Most of it before Pioli got here though. If Pioli could spot even an average QB this offense would be better than GB, NE, NO, Detroit or anybody else. A bust DE and a project NT at 11? Berry great pick but obvious since he was the best player in the draft. Baldwin has the talent to be a greatr pick no doubt but as of yet is still an unknown. My only question is outside of Berry what do we know for sure Pioi has done great outside of Berry? Then after you honestly answer that why do so many think he is a god?


In a redraft of the grass is greener on the other side who do you take over Poe this year? Keuchly was gone. Decastro would've been just as much of a project as Poe at this point. Who else do you take that fits a need?
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:14 am

That is actually easy to answer. It is known Philly was wanting to trade up. With Kuechly gone and having no interest in Decastro you trade back and pick up more picks. Chances are Poe is still there since he was a project all along, but if not you pickup another LB like Hightower or CB like kirkpatrick. You have Reiff, Brockers, or Zitler too. this was a great chance to move back pick up more picks and still get as good a player as you got at 11.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:24 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
That is actually easy to answer. It is known Philly was wanting to trade up. With Kuechly gone and having no interest in Decastro you trade back and pick up more picks. Chances are Poe is still there since he was a project all along, but if not you pickup another LB like Hightower or CB like kirkpatrick. You have Reiff, Brockers, or Zitler too. this was a great chance to move back pick up more picks and still get as good a player as you got at 11.

Kirkpatrick, maybe but I wasn't really crazy about him. Reiff was a hell no. Zeitler and Hightower would've been nice selections in a move down but both are at positions that don't really warrant 1st round picks to get good players. But then who plays NT? It was clear they wasn't sold on Powe as he didn't dress most of the time last year. I could've seen Gordon there. We were long over due for taking a NT. Hindsight is always 20/20. Hopefully Poe will develop into the stud we need there. I have seen some good things out of him so far. I hope he continues to improve.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:27 am

BigRatt wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
You still cant think of anything great he has done I guess. Nobody can give me an answer anyway.

How about the drafting of Jackson, Dex, Baldwin, Hudson, Arenas, Berry, Aso, Powe, Poe, etc? Some players are going to be absolute studs and some are just going to be good rotation players. I know your homer hate for Jackson but I have seen glimpes this preseason of a player that very well could have a breakout year. I have noticed several really nice pass rushes where he went around the end or took his player and planted there ass in the backfield. We will have to wait and see how he does this season to know for sure one way or another. How about the FA signings of Winston, Boss, Hillis, Route? How about the resigning of Charles, DJ, Hali, and Flowers? How about putting Hali and DJ in schemes that made good players, great players? The only thing I have against him at this point is the trade for Cassell. You can't really blame him for making that trade when you look at what else was available. I just hope we find a damn replacement in the near future!


Again outside of Berry they are all unknowns. Berry is the only stud. Isnt Jackson the only player even still on the team from that draft? Arenas is far from a stud. Poe was second team in what conference? no doubt a project. Projects at 11 dont seem like smart moves. Powe is a great pick based on what?
So again what things do we KNOW FOR SURE are great things Pioli has done? Still trying to figure out why ppl on here worship Pioli as a football god thats all
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:40 am

And this is not any overreaction like you hear from me on here a lot. Ratt you are more level headed on here than most so dont think I stirring anything up. I am looking for an honest answer. I really do not understand this fascination with Pioli. Too me its like the flavor of the month just never dried up here in KC even though it still hasnt produced anything extraordinary. I bring this up because I got caught up in this same crap with Dayton Moore with the Royals except I was on board with the hype. I am a huge Royals fan and got sucked in to the hype with the up and coming GM only to figure out later it was all smoke and Royals are still a joke. But at least the Royals have a legit excsuse with the economics of baseball.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:46 am

RustShack wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
RustShack wrote:
If you love mediocracy, its Carl you love, not Pioli.

Okay then explain what Pioli has done to prove otherwise that is proven. What moves has Pioli made that have absolutely panned out and proven to be great ones to date?

He took arguably the worst roster in the NFL, and about three years later has one of the most talented rosters in the NFL...

And the most talented players on this roster are Charles, Flowers, Hali, DJ, Bowe, and Berry. I'd have to back and look up for sure but I'd bet some of these were before Pioli
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:46 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
BigRatt wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
You still cant think of anything great he has done I guess. Nobody can give me an answer anyway.

How about the drafting of Jackson, Dex, Baldwin, Hudson, Arenas, Berry, Aso, Powe, Poe, etc? Some players are going to be absolute studs and some are just going to be good rotation players. I know your homer hate for Jackson but I have seen glimpes this preseason of a player that very well could have a breakout year. I have noticed several really nice pass rushes where he went around the end or took his player and planted there ass in the backfield. We will have to wait and see how he does this season to know for sure one way or another. How about the FA signings of Winston, Boss, Hillis, Route? How about the resigning of Charles, DJ, Hali, and Flowers? How about putting Hali and DJ in schemes that made good players, great players? The only thing I have against him at this point is the trade for Cassell. You can't really blame him for making that trade when you look at what else was available. I just hope we find a damn replacement in the near future!


Again outside of Berry they are all unknowns. Berry is the only stud. Isnt Jackson the only player even still on the team from that draft? Arenas is far from a stud. Poe was second team in what conference? no doubt a project. Projects at 11 dont seem like smart moves. Powe is a great pick based on what?
So again what things do we KNOW FOR SURE are great things Pioli has done? Still trying to figure out why ppl on here worship Pioli as a football god thats all

Welcome to the business of having young fucking football players! I said some are going to be studs and others are going to be solid rotation players. It takes 3 years to judge a class and your all pissed the fuck off b/c most of them aren't in the Hall of Fame yet! lol I listed Powe b/c he's been our best NT so far. Solid ass drafting, resigning players that needed signed to affordable deals, and putting players in a scheme to succeed is all he's done so far. You jizz over Carl's drafting in the early 90's but the reality is that most of the late 90's and 2000's drafts were freaking horrible! Why don't you look at how many players were drafted and now many of those turned out to be good players in the league? It's the reason that Carl was fired and Pioli was hired in the 1st damn place!


Last edited by BigRatt on Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:56 am; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:52 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
RustShack wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
RustShack wrote:
If you love mediocracy, its Carl you love, not Pioli.

Okay then explain what Pioli has done to prove otherwise that is proven. What moves has Pioli made that have absolutely panned out and proven to be great ones to date?

He took arguably the worst roster in the NFL, and about three years later has one of the most talented rosters in the NFL...

And the most talented players on this roster are Charles, Flowers, Hali, DJ, Bowe, and Berry. I'd have to back and look up for sure but I'd bet some of these were before Pioli

Of course some them were! I never said they weren't. The reality is that Charles wasn't even playing while LJ was busy running his dick into the back of the O lines asses for a yard a carry. Hali was an average 4-3 DE. DJ was good at times and very average alot of other times in the 4-3.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:59 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
And this is not any overreaction like you hear from me on here a lot. Ratt you are more level headed on here than most so dont think I stirring anything up. I am looking for an honest answer. I really do not understand this fascination with Pioli. Too me its like the flavor of the month just never dried up here in KC even though it still hasnt produced anything extraordinary. I bring this up because I got caught up in this same crap with Dayton Moore with the Royals except I was on board with the hype. I am a huge Royals fan and got sucked in to the hype with the up and coming GM only to figure out later it was all smoke and Royals are still a joke. But at least the Royals have a legit excsuse with the economics of baseball.

That's your opinion I guess. It kinda pisses me off to an extent, b/c I don't think you realize just how bad this roster was when Pioli took over. It's still not perfect but damn it's alot better than it was!
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:01 am

weird LJs career avg is 4.4 ypc. and thats with one of his 1700 yd seasons being under that. dont think LJs issues were talent
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:02 am

BigRatt wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
And this is not any overreaction like you hear from me on here a lot. Ratt you are more level headed on here than most so dont think I stirring anything up. I am looking for an honest answer. I really do not understand this fascination with Pioli. Too me its like the flavor of the month just never dried up here in KC even though it still hasnt produced anything extraordinary. I bring this up because I got caught up in this same crap with Dayton Moore with the Royals except I was on board with the hype. I am a huge Royals fan and got sucked in to the hype with the up and coming GM only to figure out later it was all smoke and Royals are still a joke. But at least the Royals have a legit excsuse with the economics of baseball.

That's your opinion I guess. It kinda pisses me off to an extent, b/c I don't think you realize just how bad this roster was when Pioli took over. It's still not perfect but damn it's alot better than it was!

This rosters stars are not Piolis.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:08 am

The thing he is doing that is really sad is holding this offense back by not doing whatever it takes to get a legit QB. His ego is so big he refuses to admit Cassel was a huge mistake. We actually have the talent to play an air it out game or a ground game against most teams. but with Cassel we are very limited in what we can do with that talent. So until he fixes his biggest mistake this team has no chance at a SB.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:11 am

so if this is truly one of the most talented teams in the league injuries cannot be an excuse for losing. the most talented rosters have depth. like GB when they won the SB with like 13 players being put on IR. so even if Lewis, Flowers, DJ, and Hali dont play week 1 we dominate the Falcons?
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:24 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
BigRatt wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
And this is not any overreaction like you hear from me on here a lot. Ratt you are more level headed on here than most so dont think I stirring anything up. I am looking for an honest answer. I really do not understand this fascination with Pioli. Too me its like the flavor of the month just never dried up here in KC even though it still hasnt produced anything extraordinary. I bring this up because I got caught up in this same crap with Dayton Moore with the Royals except I was on board with the hype. I am a huge Royals fan and got sucked in to the hype with the up and coming GM only to figure out later it was all smoke and Royals are still a joke. But at least the Royals have a legit excsuse with the economics of baseball.

That's your opinion I guess. It kinda pisses me off to an extent, b/c I don't think you realize just how bad this roster was when Pioli took over. It's still not perfect but damn it's alot better than it was!

This rosters stars are not Piolis.

I forgot Houston and Moeaki! Some more to add to the Pioli count.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:25 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
The thing he is doing that is really sad is holding this offense back by not doing whatever it takes to get a legit QB. His ego is so big he refuses to admit Cassel was a huge mistake. We actually have the talent to play an air it out game or a ground game against most teams. but with Cassel we are very limited in what we can do with that talent. So until he fixes his biggest mistake this team has no chance at a SB.

How many QBs did Carl pass over in the draft? How many years under Carl including the Vermiel years did we have a legit chance to win a SB? The last real contender that I can think of was the AFC Championship team with Montana. When was that like 94 or 95?
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:31 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
so if this is truly one of the most talented teams in the league injuries cannot be an excuse for losing. the most talented rosters have depth. like GB when they won the SB with like 13 players being put on IR. so even if Lewis, Flowers, DJ, and Hali dont play week 1 we dominate the Falcons?

I said it was a hell of alot better than it was. It's still not perfect! You don't read with worth a shit! Anytime a team loses 3 impact players like we did it's not going to be good.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:32 am

Chiefs09 wrote:
The thing he is doing that is really sad is holding this offense back by not doing whatever it takes to get a legit QB. His ego is so big he refuses to admit Cassel was a huge mistake. We actually have the talent to play an air it out game or a ground game against most teams. but with Cassel we are very limited in what we can do with that talent. So until he fixes his biggest mistake this team has no chance at a SB.

Didn't Carl pass over Aaron Rodgers in the Draft?
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:33 am

What does Carl passing on Aaron have to do with the fact Pioli still thinks Cassel is a hall of fame QB in the NFL? I wasnt comparing there. I said there is no chance to win a SB until Pioli admits his mistake and fixes it. But Carl didnt have a clue on QBs either to answer. KCs only franchise guy in its history is Len. Also the only one to go to a SB for the Chiefs.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:36 am

BigRatt wrote:
Chiefs09 wrote:
so if this is truly one of the most talented teams in the league injuries cannot be an excuse for losing. the most talented rosters have depth. like GB when they won the SB with like 13 players being put on IR. so even if Lewis, Flowers, DJ, and Hali dont play week 1 we dominate the Falcons?

I said it was a hell of alot better than it was. It's still not perfect! You don't read with worth a shit! Anytime a team loses 3 impact players like we did it's not going to be good.

My reading is fine. if you knew how youd understand it was in reference to a post I just quoted a few posts back from rust. he says it is one of the best in the entire league. I also read good enough to understand you and rust both worship Pioli as a god even though he really hasnt done anything in KC yet.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 10:39 am

But if your idea of a great GM is to win a mediocre division with a mediocre team only to be hammered and shown to be a joke in round 1 of the playoffs once every 3 or 4 years then Pioli has done great.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:57 pm

All the players you are saying are good are the ones that Pioli didn't draft. But you fail to realize they weren't good under Carl/Herm. Because you don't understand that it takes time to develop a team. Only a complete moron tries to judge a first time GM after three years.

We went from being one of the least talented to one of the most talented in a real shot amount of time. There are 32 GM's in the NFL, and if owners were as stupid as you then at least 28 owners would be fired every three years for not winning the Super Bowl.

It is 100x harder to find a franchise QB than you think.

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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:31 pm

RustShack wrote:
All the players you are saying are good are the ones that Pioli didn't draft. But you fail to realize they weren't good under Carl/Herm. Because you don't understand that it takes time to develop a team. Only a complete moron tries to judge a first time GM after three years.

We went from being one of the least talented to one of the most talented in a real shot amount of time. There are 32 GM's in the NFL, and if owners were as stupid as you then at least 28 owners would be fired every three years for not winning the Super Bowl.

It is 100x harder to find a franchise QB than you think.

Guess you are a complete moron then fro thinking he is a football g od after 3 seasons. We both judge him just opposite ends of the spectrum. Goes to my point why do you guys worship him and think every move he makes is right when in fact we know nothing of his moves other than Cassel sucks and Jackson is a bust.
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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:44 pm

I kinda crossed the line there, but honestly how many GM's have ever taken a bottom five team for the previous few years and turned it into a Super Bowl team in only three years?

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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:48 pm

Taking one of the worst teams and turning it into one of the most talented in that short of time is a pretty impressive thing for me. I see no reason to think hes not going in the right direction...

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PostSubject: Re: KC looking for QB?   Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:11 pm

One of the most talented. They have proved without a doubt they seriously lack depth. Our 2s have been destroyed. And that isnt something you can just say its only preseason to. they were physically destroyed. I would say its the coaches that took Cars players and made them better. last I checked Pioli isnt the one coaching these guys. So far Piolis only stud pick up is Berry. But if 1 every 3 to 4 years is a good clip then hes doing a great job. other than that hes has shown he will seriously reach for unproven guys.
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